Last Friday I debated Bumper Graham, the assistant general secretary of the Northern Ireland Public Service Alliance, on Radio Ulster. The topic was his union’s call for industrial action to oppose the cuts the public sector in Northern Ireland.
It’s fair to say it got rather heated.
To listen to Bumper you’d think he was talking about Northern Ireland’s own money that was being withheld from it. You’d think a great injustice was being served upon a self-sufficient people. You’d think the people of Northern Ireland were being robbed by their own leaders. Please. Give it a rest.
Northern Ireland is a beggar.
Bumper and his ilk are quite happy spending to their hearts content because ultimately they’re not spending their own money. They’re spending the money of taxpayers in England. To the tune of some £7bn every single year* (for a population the size of a handful of London boroughs).
And let me be clear, as someone born and raised in Northern Ireland who now lives in London and will never return to the province, I feel sickened by the way ‘my country’ comes cap-in-hand; particularly at a time when the people in England have their own financial challenges to contend with.
And don’t give me the ‘Northern Ireland is a special case’. For sure it has significant issues associated with the Troubles, and yes a degree of support is needed, but ultimately it’s people like Bumper who make Northern Ireland the basket case it is.
It’s people like him who the cut the feet from under any attempt at developing a thriving economy. It’s people like him who create the incentive for so many young people in Northern Ireland to leave as soon they possibly can.
After all, what opportunity is there in a nation which wants nothing more than to live off the hard work of others. It’s pathetic, and so long as there are people like Bumper around that’s how it will stay.
*See the 2007 Oxford Economics report: Regional Contributions to UK Public Finances. It’s also worth highlighting a recent quote from Owen Paterson: “77.6% of Northern Ireland's GDP is dependent on state spending."
UPDATE09/06/2011 0930 @belfastjj has pointed out that he thought that this post was referring to the people of Northern Ireland on Twitter and asked that I clarify that that is not the case. Needless to say, I’m happy to offer that clarification. I am talking about the nation itself and the leaders. In fact, when you get to the heart of the issue, the fault really lies at the leaders’ doorsteps.
Comments
David Woods / June 06 2011 1:27pm
I'll hastily spin you a reply, Shane...
I wonder why it is important to you in this article not only to show that you were originally from Northern Ireland, but quickly part yourself from any feelings of having roots there? It seems a moot point to bring that up in the first place, as if to justify your ability to make such a sweeping comment about the financial situation in the North of Ireland (see what I did there). It also reads very much as 'I'm ashamed of where I'm from", which is fine, but you should just say it.
If your answer is to introduce some kind of private enterprise into Northern Ireland to take away from the governmental 'cap in hand' attitude of the public sector, I'm all ears to hear how you will do it. Considering I'm currently working for a large British (read: English) company whose relocated some major operations of it's British business into the 'cheap' area Northern Ireland, I'm still working at less than half of the average UK wage.
So, explain to me then, how you, as a government institute a change in businesses like that to pay fairly its employees? Can you blame a graduate who has no reason or want to relocate to the likes of London to take a job in the Public Sector in Northern Ireland? No, surely you cant.
By no means am I a Irish Republican (as you know), but what then is the answer, in general, to your quandary? Give the North back to the Republic? Save 7BN£ PA from now on on public spending? That might just make the first dinge in the monetary disaster London got the country as a whole into over the past 15 years.
Of course, we won't need to do that once the IMF roll in with their loans (which will nicely pay off all the high rollers who ballsed up in the first place!)
This place with such a small population, year on year has the highest statistical output of educated 18 year olds than anywhere in the UK. Do you really want to discount it?
john / June 06 2011 5:10pm
only slightly higher than Strathclyde then,,,,,
Gerry Slater / June 06 2011 5:39pm
Rather a strident and ill-tempered piece, but the fundamental analysis is correct. The attitude in Northern Ireland is overly coloured by the feeling that 'the State' should come up with the money for any initiative. Of course, it is not alone in the UK in suffering from that malady.
I too am packing up and leaving Northern Ireland, and I too shall not return. However, I do see real strengths in its people. I just wish they were freed from the mind-numbing State-interventionist approach.
G Thomas / June 06 2011 5:41pm
Same story in Wales. Evening news dominated by gloom and doom - all caused by 'the cuts' - nothing to do with Labour misrule, running out of other people's money or any kind of deficit between how much Wales can filch from English taxpayers, or that those taxpayers don't actually pay enough tax to cover the country's costs. Just one long whine about cuts with the population patronised into thinking there's a straight choice between wicked Tory cuts and honest Labour spending of other people's money on Wales.
NI, Scotland, Wales and the North of England - all resentful, infantilised, addicted beggars who have long lost their history and tradition of self respect and independence.
Herbert / June 06 2011 6:51pm
'It’s people like him who the cut the feet from under any attempt at developing a thriving economy.'
In what way? Or is that just your default sneer for trade unionists?
Mr Ed / June 06 2011 8:46pm
The same might be said of the North-East of England, to be fair. The problem for Northern Ireland is that the State is so smothering that the only rational (not honest) way to make a living is through it, and so long as the tap of funding is on, it will remain so.
Cut back the State and private enterprise could flourish. It would mean that many people now prosperous and powerful would become poor. It would also mean that people would see each other as potential trading partners, rather than potential foes from the other side of the divide. "Ou il y a du commerce, il y a des moeurs douces" (Where there is trade, there are good manners).
Shane Greer / June 07 2011 8:05am
Herbert,
They cut the feet from under any attempt at developing a thriving economy by perpetuating Northern Ireland's dependency on taxpayers in England. Simples.
Mark Gordon / June 07 2011 8:39am
Straight from the hip, and bang on.
Great to read that piece which sums up the total lack of responsibility for its own economy that sums up present-day Northern Ireland. Unlike its proud past of industrious innovation and excellence, NI simply and unashamedly relies on handouts.
Classic and predictable response from the usual NI apologist - 'it's not our fault, it's the English..' The point is that something has to be done as a collective effort, and not simply rely on government handouts, or wait for magical external investment. There must be creation, innovation, export of commodities/ideas etc. By the way, if you don't want to work for your paltry wage, get another job, or create your own business. Your attitude sums up the malaise.
The article is bang on. As someone who has moved back to NI simply for the quality of education (paid for) for my kids, it is extremely frustrating to daily listen to nonsensical idiots such as 'Bumper' without any balancing view.
Great article.
David Woods / June 07 2011 8:46am
Cut public spending to allow commerce to flourish is all well and good, so long as there is a solid framework to detract from the exploitation of workers. Not to sound all socialist or anything, but I bring back my first point. You've a choice at the moment in Northern Ireland as Shane fails to see: You either get a £12k PA job working privately or a £24k per year working for the state (in some respect).
What idiot would want to line the pockets of 10 people on a board (in London)?
Unfortunately, the employment climate in Northern Ireland has many people (myself included) over a barrel by private industry. They say 'we're in a recession', so I get a 0.4% increase in my annual wage, even though there's a 4% hike in the cost of living. Yet the company prospers out of the very recession it's using as a crutch not to pay it's employees.
If the conservative government, sorry, coalition government, can sort out fair pay - I'm all for working privately.
They do however run a risk of widening an already apparent class divide.
dan / June 07 2011 9:31am
Shane is being torn apart on BBC Radio Ulster right now. Absolutely hilarious.
David Gibson / June 07 2011 9:48am
Shane, I heard the debate on Radio Ulster on the way into work this morning. Well done. You are absolutely right. Unfortunately we are turning ourselves into a 'basket case'. As for the 'English' causing the problem...please, this is a classic mope (most oppressed people ever) attitude. I for one appreciated your comments.
Matt Johnston / June 07 2011 10:19am
The cuts are coming whether we like it or debate it or take action on it. It's why I laughed at all of the election posters which proclaimed "Fight The Cuts". Personally I *fear* the cuts but this has energised me into trying to do something to make sure we still have an economy when the "free money" goes.
The question is whether anyone wants to talk about it or do something about it.
Mark Gordon / June 07 2011 10:49am
Straight from the hip, and bang on.
Great to read that piece which sums up the total lack of responsibility for its own economy that sums up present-day Northern Ireland. Unlike its proud past of industrious innovation and excellence, NI simply and unashamedly relies on handouts.
Classic and predictable response from the usual NI apologist - 'it's not our fault, it's the English..' The point is that something has to be done as a collective effort, and not simply rely on government handouts, or wait for magical external investment. There must be creation, innovation, export of commodities/ideas etc. By the way, if you don't want to work for your paltry wage, get another job, or create your own business. Your attitude sums up the malaise.
The article is bang on. As someone who has moved back to NI simply for the quality of education (paid for) for my kids, it is extremely frustrating to daily listen to nonsensical idiots such as 'Bumper' without any balancing view.
Great article.
Stephen Gash / June 07 2011 11:28am
It must be nice having a parliament or assembly that represents one's own people. I wish we English had our own parliament focusing on England's needs.
john williamson - Arm Chair ThinkTank / June 07 2011 12:29pm
wow i didnt even know alot this - some good comments on both sides - i supose ultimately it similar to our benefits system -
people have been so dependant on it for so long. The cycle has to be broken so they stop depending on handouts so much
nice article tho but i did get the same feeling DAVID WOODS did when he says "im ashamed of were i am from
Bumper Graham / June 07 2011 12:59pm
Shane needs to close his mouth and open his ears,he missed the point completely that the UK Government allocates funding based on the Barnett formula to NI,Wales,Scotland and the English regions based on an assessment of need.Furthermore that all UK taxpayers make equal PAYE/NIC contributions.He clearly also forgot about the Scottish gas/oil revenues that London stole if you follow his logic.
If the NI economy is to go forward it will need the private sector to invest and not see NI as another offshore tax haven should the siren calls from Shane and his tory camp followers of the CBI/IOD get corporation tax reduced to ROI levels.I understand Shane knows a lot about non-dom tax issues.
NI needs it's public sevices to not only meet the needs of those in need but also to assist economic regeneration. The problem with the bulk of the private sector is they see NI as a means of obtaining grant aid and then when exhausted moving on to the next Country to offer similar aid .It also helps the private sector vultures that NI is sold as a low wage economy.
Lets develop a proper economy that values public sevices and provides longterm sustainable real jobs via decent private sector compnies who unlike Shane have a committment to NI.
Finally,glad to hear he won't be back with his fake bought in american twang. accent
Stephen Gash / June 07 2011 1:04pm
It must be nice having a parliament or assembly that represents one's own people. I wish we English had our own parliament focusing on England's needs.
Junior Johnson / June 07 2011 1:40pm
Here Here Shane, I can't wait to leave this backward sinister hovel. Fuck the begrudgers, they've an agenda. They're all still talking of the problem and half arsed solutions. Because that's what we do, a self entitled poor me shower of charlatans.
'if it was raining soup, the Irish would be out with forks' - Behan.
Herbert / June 07 2011 2:44pm
'Shane Greer / June 07 2011
Herbert,
They cut the feet from under any attempt at developing a thriving economy by perpetuating Northern Ireland's dependency on taxpayers in England. Simples.'
What, trade unionists in the private sector as well as the private? Wasn't there an interesting paradox that the British economy (and the share of wealth that workers received) was greater when the trade union movement was stronger?
And don't you think using the expression 'Simples' is a bit juvenile?
Mrs P / June 07 2011 2:48pm
In response to Bumper Grahams non sensical personal assualt on Shane Greers accent. Sorry is Bumper a name? Listened to the BBC Radio Ulster show this morning and really the people who called in were a total embarassment. No wonder NI is stuck in the past revelling in inquiry after inquiry - just get on with it.
I live in North Down and am fully aware that Westminster money provides infrastructure and services in order that we can enjoy a good quality of life. We both work hard and provide for our children.
I support Shane and the comments he has made - it is reality, however difficult for the mopers to swallow.
Mark Gordon / June 07 2011 4:10pm
Straight from the hip, and bang on.
Great to read that piece which sums up the total lack of responsibility for its own economy that sums up present-day Northern Ireland. Unlike its proud past of industrious innovation and excellence, NI simply and unashamedly relies on handouts.
Classic and predictable response from the usual NI apologist - 'it's not our fault, it's the English..' The point is that something has to be done as a collective effort, and not simply rely on government handouts, or wait for magical external investment. There must be creation, innovation, export of commodities/ideas etc. By the way, if you don't want to work for your paltry wage, get another job, or create your own business. Your attitude sums up the malaise.
The article is bang on. As someone who has moved back to NI simply for the quality of education (paid for) for my kids, it is extremely frustrating to daily listen to nonsensical idiots such as 'Bumper' without any balancing view.
Great article.
Claire Nic an Bhaird / June 07 2011 5:01pm
This is remarkably badly written article, with a total absence of focus - except maybe an insultingly weak retaliation against Bumper Graham. If you're going to criticise the dependence of NI on public funds, then surely blame lies with the private sector for lack of investment, or successive administrations that saw nothing wrong with adding to an already bloated public sector?
Criticism of public sector trade union officials who are against cutting one of the very few employment routes available to people who choose to stay here instead of loudly crowing about their ability to catch the first boat out when they turn legal, particularly without offering any viable alternatives or suggestions, is just idiotic.
In fact, this article seems to be an incredibly thinly constructed reason for you to have a go at someone you apparently couldn't debate terribly well with, and laud your own depature from the country. Much as it pains me to be so petty - you must be terribly, terribly insecure.
Incidentally - your argument would be (very slightly) strengthened by referring to more recent figures.
Noel / June 07 2011 9:57pm
Dear Mr Greer, I and I am sure many others will take great comfort from the fact that you have left the North of Ireland and that you are not returning, please no change of heart on your part. I heard your contributions to the Nolan show on 3/6/11 and 6/6/11 and I commend Nolan for engaging you, you are a quite simply a wind up merchant, nothing wrong with that... but there is something very shallow about anyone who leaves his homeland vowing never to return, goes to live in a neighbouring country (England), then turns native, it's risible.
Your main point that the south east of England subsidizes Northern Ireland is probably true ... but so what? it's the price the Brits have to pay for meddling in other nations affairs. Northern Ireland is a failed political entity, the IRA managed to get the British Government to concede this when Peter Brook declared that Britain had no political or strategic interest in the place. If a British Act of parliament (the 1920 Government of Ireland Act) can create the place, then surely another similar act can "uncreate" it.. at a stroke you have your 7 billion back in spades, back in the pockets of the taxpayers in the South East of England that keep harping on about ... yet .. you... can never be " one of them ".
Here is something for you to dwell upon. Some inarticulate callers to Nolan's show today made great play of your accent ( a fusion of Northern Irish, English and an American spouse apparently ... yeah sure !.) to be honest it did grate on my ears too. I put this to you... if you were to guest on any Radio 4 programme broadcasting to your beloved Home Counties with that mutated Irish accent you wouldn't get the time of day... you see Shane, my fellow Irish man, you'll always be a Paddy over there, ask Gerry Anderson!
Shane Greer / June 08 2011 1:22am
You seem to have a rather large chip on your shoulder when it comes to Irish identity. Personally, I happen to prefer England to Northern Ireland. But I never deny being Irish/British.
As for getting the time of day on Radio 4, you can add that to the list of other national stations I appear on. But then, I'm willing to bet that prejudice informs a lot of your comment.
N R GREER / June 13 2011 8:27pm
Excellent and accurate piece. Well said.
Anonymous / June 29 2011 6:24pm
Shane, one thing which is overwhelmingly clear from your article/views and your distinctly false accent, is that you appear to be embarrassed by your herritage, social antecedents and background. I am no psychiatrist/psycologist but perhaps an explanation for the forgoing is that you are carrying a severe inferiority complex which manifests in your desire to assimilate with and portray yourelf as an English thatcherite by attacking your roots because you possibly see this as a means of ridding yourself of your social background/heritage.